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gameplay is my favorite in mainline smt but the story is terrible

I came to Shin Megami Tensei IV: Apocalypse with some trepidation. I really loved the previous game, Shin Megami Tensei IV, and was concerned about how returning to that world one more time would turn out. Well, I needn't have worried, as Apocalypse's reinterpretation of the original game is superb and has a lot of improvements that make it a superior experience in some ways. 

The standout feature of this game is the superb combat system. Making turn-based combat thrilling is a difficult thing, but Apocalypse, even above the previous game, has maybe the best combat of any turn-based RPG I have played. Each member of your team does something, and then it is the enemy's turn, but if you do a critical strike or hit a weakness, you can attack again and have the possibility to smirk, which temporarily increases your stats and do extra damage. It is a dynamic and masterfully designed system that really makes you consider each moment. When you first meet a demon, you know nothing about their resistances or weaknesses, so it is up to you to either work it out during the combat or find enough of them to uncover the stats. It can lead to some harsh moments where you attack a demon only to find out it blocks, reflects, or nullifies it. If this happens, you forfeit the rest of your turns, and it is your enemy's turn. If that happens, there is a high likelihood that they'll be smirking and will unleash some serious damage. It is this risk-reward design that makes every encounter a mini-puzzle, even if you already know the demon's weaknesses. It feels fantastic whenever you make a critical strike or go into a smirking state, but equally, you are hit with a tsunami of dread whenever an enemy does the same. Apocalypse is an exceedingly difficult game. You can mitigate that with buffs and some particularly strong spells, but with one bad spell from you, a seemingly innocuous fight can quickly fall apart as the enemy smirks and then does a very powerful critical hit. The bosses present a unique challenge, with many requiring multiple attempts to defeat them. While moments of frustration may arise from the occasional stroke of misfortune, such instances are rare. The superbly crafted combat system ensures that the difficulty remains ‘tough but fair,’ striking a balance that keeps the experience engaging.

The RPG elements in Apocalypse retain that SMT IV style. You still collect demons by trying to convince them to join your team; you still combine them to create new demons and even evolve them at times. Something I love about these two games is the focus on sacrifice. You’re constantly faced with challenging decisions regarding the abilities you and your demons acquire, a mechanic that adds significant depth to each level. To share a personal experience, I had an accident fusing demons early on, resulting in a formidable ally that evolved and accompanied me throughout the game. It was awesome. There is a lot of flavour to the RPG mechanics. Each ability is an 'app'; the demons have a dash of personality, the place you visit to combine demons is called the Cathedral of Shadows and is hosted by some pixelated entity called Mido and all the menus are in your smartphone. It really adds to the overall atmosphere of the game and makes up for some lacklustre graphics.

While it may seem unjust to critique the graphics of an older title on a dated handheld console, certain design aspects appear to be lacking. The exploration of the world and dungeons, set against the backdrop of a modern Tokyo, often feels uninspired. The couple of exceptions are the later game dungeons, which can get very psychedelic. The overworld map suffers from the same issue. The NPC designs, excluding the main cast, are unfortunately lacklustre and overly repetitive. However, the game truly excels in the design of the demons and the main characters. I love the former a great deal; there are so many iconic designs here that I think are better than SMT 4. Mara is a particular highlight, being a massive penis monster attached to a chariot, as is Frosty Jack (and the variations within that archetype). The main cast is fine; I especially like Hallejuah and Dagda, but the real achievement is the boss design. Each boss is meticulously detailed, conveying a divine presence befitting their status. The character design carries the visual experience, showcasing Atlus’ strategy paid off.

Describing the plot of Apocalypse conjures images of both awe and madness. You are slain and subsequently resurrected by the deity Dagda, who charges you with the daunting task of vanquishing other gods. The ultimate goal? To amalgamate all human souls into a singular energy sphere, liberating them from the shackles of mortality. The antagonists, renowned deities with designs to dominate humanity, present formidable challenges. Your journey is a tapestry of mythic encounters: wielding Excalibur against a colossal dragon, shattering a soul-draining egg that preys upon Tokyo’s inhabitants, battling celestial beings in the heavens, and even confronting Krishna. All that sounds exceedingly cool, and it is, but the stuff between isn't that engaging. There is only so much love triangle drama one can handle and the resolution to the Dagda plot was rather flaccid. It’s here that Apocalypse falls short of its predecessor, SMT IV, which weaved a narrative rich in coherence and detail, punctuated by moments of grandeur.

So yeah, Shin Megami Tensei IV: Apocalypse is a superb game. There were multiple times, mainly after defeating a particularly difficult boss, where I was literally celebrating like I had scored a goal. It surpasses its predecessor, Shin Megami Tensei IV, in nearly every aspect, narrative aside. However, that’s hardly a drawback, as the game presents a coherent story that skilfully sets the stage for remarkable encounters. Looking ahead, I’m keen to delve into more Shin Megami Tensei games to discover the diverse interpretations of the franchise’s signature style.

Absoluta obra maestra de los jrpgs, deja la ambientación tan deprimente del 4 original y acá nos la ponen como algo mas cotidiano y no externo (sigue siendo igual de deprimente). La nueva música es increíble simplemente temazo tras temazo especialmente los temas de boss (battle f2, f4, f6, f7, f8). Mejoraron los mayores problemas del smt4 original, el mapa ya no es un laberinto en el que perderse ahora es mas directo y te dice a donde ir (gracias).
Volvieron al combate perfecto al ya no depender del RNG en gran medida y estabilizar la mécanica del smirk, las afinidades son una implementación maravillosa le mete mas peso a las fusiones y a como buildeas a tus demonios, los combates también con todas estas mejoras se sienten mas satisfactorios en todos los sentidos, el explotar debilidades no puede ser mas gratificante y hay bosses que son un autentico desafio, especialmente en el final. La historia implementa lore my importante para comprender el universo de smt4 pero la nueva narrativa presentada por los dioses de los Poderes Divinos, es interesante a mas no poder y presenta dilemas qe de verdad te hacen cuestionar las cosas y estas divinidades tienen bastante presencia e imponen mucho pero el que destaca por sobre todos es Dagda, (CUIDADO SPOILERS) simplemente magistral lo que hicieron con el, un personaje que en principios parece un edgy total pero que mientras lo conoces ves que no es asi y busca algo mas alla de simples intereses vanales, el solo quiere regresar a los dioses a su estado original. El combate final es eclesiástico y súper emotivo cuando sacas el final de los "vìnculos", juegazo absoluto y te hace encariñar con su mundo pero especialmente con sus personajes, que entiendo el disgusto general que tienen con la historia y los personajes pero lo que cuentan y la manera como lo hacen solo realza a este juego.

Pretty much an improvement in every way regarding the gameplay but a downgrade in every way regarding the writing and characters, but still nice to explore more of this fantastic world they've built. Worth it for the final boss alone. While I do have some major gripes with the writing, both endings offer a satisfying conclusion to the SMT4 saga.

I absolutely hate like 85% of this game, but from the Cosmic Egg onward (including Twisted Tokyo), this suddenly becomes much better; though, no amount of solid boss encounters can save the jaw-droppingly terrible story.


Beaucoup de fans de SMT ne l'ont pas apprécié pour ses soucis d'écritures en général et son côté un peu plus "cliché anime" avec des situations un peu bizarres, et je comprends.
Moins bon que SMT IV en termes de cast et de récit, il reprend quand même la route la moins complète du jeu précédent en venant lui apporter un scénario alternatif et une fin plus joyeuse, classique et satisfaisante.

Mais il faut dire ce qui est, le gameplay est formidable et nettement plus agréable que celui de SMT IV. Les nouvelles musiques sont géniales. Je suis assez mitigé sur le nouveau cast cela dit, car il y a d'excellents éléments comme d'assez mauvais/maladroits ou facilement oubliables...

Le donjon final était infernal et certains twists n'étaient pas terribles, puis les choix pris tout au long du jeu ne sont pas importants malheureusement (mais changent tout de même 2-3 dialogues à certains moments). J'ai bien aimé les deux fins, et incarner un humain qui vit dans Tokyo était un très bon choix. Le jeu n'est pas excellent MAIS je l'ai adoré comme il est

Yeah the plot is very “anime” but I actually like the crew now plus the combat and music are next level. That final dungeon is unforgivable though, sure the events and design are great I just don't think it needed to be designed so poorly…

nunca pensei que eu odiaria um careca por um motivo que nao fosse ele ser careca

This review contains spoilers

nanashi in heaven: i know how to crank 90s

God: GET OUT‼️

The story is super weird, they went into wrong direction for SMT IV. BUT GAMEPLAY THEY NEARLY PERFECTED SMT IV I LOVE THIS GAME

This review contains spoilers

everything about this game is absolutely amazing until you get to the last dungeon which is a nightmare to get through, the game just throw a lot of demons at you but you cannot make contact or turn them into your ally , the game in that point is to just grind and grind through a long huge maze of nothingness after this finish the final boss i think i will not touch any smt or dungeon crawling game for a while because this game have one of the most terrible dungeon in the history of gaming

This review contains spoilers

the writing in this game is SO bad but im addicted to it. it's my fav gameplay of any megaten game. also what other game lets you become god and make one of ur male friends your goddess who "creates more people" for you

A solid game, if you prefer the darker grittier feel of older smt games then it's fair to say that it's not all that great, but the story is quite easy to digest and interesting at least in my opinion.

It's pretty good. The qol features are great and I love seeing the world getting expanded more, especially from the perspective of an up and coming hunter. I do feel it lacked in some areas like in the characters. It'd be nice if there was some quests or stories set aside for them. Though I like what we have now.
Fun game, last dungeon is a slog. Get a map online if you can, you'll need it.

This game is like the polar opposite of IV. The combat is fun and challenging, they really nerfed and tweaked everything that made IV too simple/easy (well, except giving the player free revives for most of the game meaning you never really fear losing).
The story just takes a huge dump on everything that the series is supposed to be about. And by that I mean the totally unabashed and uncritical glorification of Neutral (though the cringey anime tropes don't help).

I dropped the game the moment Navarre said "it's Navarre time", fine game, addresses the issues I have with SMT 4's gameplay, but the writing is intolerable.

I might give it another shot sometime, for now I stand that dropping this and playing Etrian Odyssey 5 was the best decision I ever made.

The improvements to gameplay, characters and story from the original to apocalypse are amazing, and it also gives us some of the best worldbuilding in a mainline megaten. I love the power of friendship.

Explains more things that happened in the SMT IV universe.

Gameplay is much more balanced than 4 but the story goes into cliche cringe anime about killing god with the power of friendship.

Playing in Japanese. Aside from Xander Mobus's legendary performance as Dagda, ATLUS West really dropped the ball here.

This game feels like a love letter to the entire history of Megami Tensei. It takes cues from every notable game in the franchise. While SMT IV was more original in setting, this game has a somewhat basic setting of living in the demon infested Tokyo during the apocalypse, except this time, you're not a messiah. You're just a regular person. I can easily imagine this game working in the world of SMT I or II. It's a standard setting with a really interesting setup.

The direction this game goes with its story and themes are very interesting and unique for the series and I wish a lot of people had the literary analysis beyond "friendship is power?? Not in my MegaTen!!!"

This game is secretly extremely anti-religion and portrays how religion exists only to divide and control humans, and that the only way peace can be achieved in a world with religion is if every human is enslaved to that religion.

Another thing it is about is the inherent flaw in "choosing the lesser evil," instead of striving for something better.

The way I'm going to review this is from the POV of a guy who had already played this game 5 years ago, enjoyed it just as much then, and decided to go from Easy to Hard for this particular playthrough, after waiting just as long to play the OG SMT IV for... some reason. For anyone who wants my thoughts on base IV, a review of the game in question is sequestered hence within my profile.

I'll frontload this review with a few quick, minor complaints - primarily the existence of compendium premiums for resist/null passives (one of my favourite ways to play SMT games to this day, and a type of skill I'd argue is just as, if not more important, than buffs), and a few other daft skill distribution decisions (iirc the earliest level you get any buff or debuff is Angel at Level 12-15 or so). So going through some of the early areas, you're liable to get your shit kicked in. I ended up dropping the difficulty for Fusion and Compendium purposes, because otherwise you're forking out about 170k+ for mid-Lv. 40ish mons with resist passives, whilst waiting for the best relic spots to respawn.

What do I like about this game?
...Yeah, well... EVERYTHING ELSE.

Once you get over the minor skill optimisation hiccups, when battles start giving you momentum, they REALLY give you momentum. While you could argue that the reworked Hama/Mudo spells are a bit of an overcorrection from base IV, given their coverage, I... honestly fail to care (especially what they can do vs hordes, and how Smirking was handled here). And (I know this isn't gameplay, but it certainly helps) it's partnered with honestly my favourite regular battle OST in the entirety of SMT (before anyone asks, DDS2 isn't far behind).

QUICK EDIT: something I neglected to mention was that on the overworld, you actually have an idea of where the hell you're going this time. QoL and all that.

Now, let's touch on the story and characters. "There's too much power of friendship!" So I've heard. "It's not nuanced or fleshed out enough!" (even though base IV's approach to the topic was kinda :kek:).

OK, and?

For one, I fundamentally disagree with the lack of nuance. For as much as I'd love to deconstruct individual examples (Danu remaking Dagda, and a lot of aspects of the Divine Powers come to mind), I'd argue that this is one of the better narratives in the series, and I do mean that. And yes, my BOI Hallelujah is a personal channel mascot of mine for a reason.

Something else I want to tip my hat to before we end off, and one thing I don't think people give Apoc' enough credit for, is how genuinely funny this game is. Dagda is a no-nonsense middle finger to existence that I actually find genuine refreshing, not to mention Xander Mobus capturing his personality so well I'd make the claim it's among his best, if not his best, voice work. Yes, even better than Joker, Stocke, or even DBa Superman. It's damn close to my favourite, that's for certain. I also caught myself laughing for minutes on end at stuff like Navarre getting brutally roasted (ftr: I disagree with Nam's Compendium that his character only 'existed for jokes at his expense' or whatever, mostly for reasons of ludonarrative dissonance (him being one of the best partners from a gameplay standpoint) as well as Sean Chiplock sounding like he was having a lot of fun playing the role).

I'll admit I didn't have as much to say about this game as I thought I would. But all's fair in love and war, I suppose.

Combat is really fine tuned but the story is really off for a smt game. It suffers the same issue as the previous game where getting money feels like a chore so you aren't incentivized to fuse or really buy any armor. If i had the money dlc in a first playthrough I definitely would not have lowered the difficulty at the final boss (it's extremely strong) and would have probably fused better demons.

I love the gameplay.

But the story.. It was dragged out for such a long time, it kind of soured my experience.

Gameplay improved but the story is just so lame... it drags.


Normally an Atlus re-release is an annoying affair but this felt more like a sequel than a re-release with a new dungeon and new character. Being able to go through the game and live as the background characters from the first was a nice way to relive the game while then converging with the previous one for an excellent climax. Was the theme of the final boss heavy handed? Yeah but not enough to detract from the whole game as a whole

The gameplay for Apocalypse is an improvement in every way compared to SMT IV. Even though the story is questionable at times I kinda wish we could get another SMT like this one day.

Minha porta de entrada para a série Megaten, Bom é simplesmente uma bela pedra de crack, que depois de consumido, vc virá um fan incontestável, é o pokemon adulto que sempre queriamos

And that this was the sequel to the already convoluted plot and chewing more than it could bite, but damn if that chewing wasn't tasty.